Saudi Arabia, Turkey and Pakistan have signed the Mecca Pact, a new defence alliance built around the promise that an attack on one is an attack on all. Together they bring Saudi money and religious authority, Turkey’s military strength and defence industry and Pakistan’s army and nuclear power. But would any of them really go to war for the others? Tom and Patrick are joined by Lieutenant General Sir Simon Mayall to explore why the pact has emerged now. Is it a response to Iran’s decline, growing doubts over America’s reliability or the changing relationship with Israel? Or is the Mecca Pact merely a strategic hedge, or the beginning of a new balance of power in the Middle East? How do you think the Mecca Defence Alliance will impact the region? Get in touch: generalandjournalist@thetimes.co.uk 00:00 - Mecca Pact Explained 05:04 - Saudi–Turkey–Pakistan Defence Alliance 13:02 - Why the Mecca Pact Matters Now 23:32 - Is the Mecca Pact a New NATO? 32:53 - Future of Middle East Security Guest: Ltn Gen Sir Simon Mayall, KBE, CB, retired British Army officer and a Middle East Adviser at the Ministry of Defence. Hosts: General Sir Patrick Sanders and Tom Newton Dunn. Patrick brings his experience as a former head of the British Army to the podcast. He is also a Conservative peer and advises the party on defence. Producer: Julia Webster and Shabnam Grewal Executive producer: Priyanka Deladia Image: Dana Chan, Getty Clips: Getty Read the best of our journalism: https://www.thetimes.com/ Listen live to Times Radio: https://www.thetimes.com/radio/live Subscribe to The Times and The Sunday Times YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/subscription_center?add_user=timesonlinevideo Find us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/timesandsundaytimes/ Find us on X: https://x.com/thetimes Find us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thetimes/