WATCH FULL EPISODE: https://youtu.be/SbEng6UYapY Subscribe Here: @JulianDoreyDaily ZACH's LINKS: IG: https://www.instagram.com/zachary.loft/?hl=en YT: https://www.youtube.com/@ZachFoustShow/videos WEBSITE: https://zachary-loft-shop.fourthwall.com/ Newsletter: https://juliandoreypodcast.beehiiv.com/get-julians-top-10-books CLIPPERS DISCORD: https://discord.com/invite/8QmWEKJ3BT --- John Kiriakou is one of the most prominent CIA critics in the American public sphere. He was the first US official to confirm the CIA's use of waterboarding as torture. He served 23 months in federal prison after being prosecuted under the Espionage Act. He has appeared on Joe Rogan built a significant Substack following toured Europe with an evening show and become one of the most trusted voices for people who believe the CIA cannot be trusted. And Zach Foust — a rogue investigator who has spent significant time pulling threads on the intelligence community — has developed a specific and documented theory that John Kiriakou is still CIA. Julian Dorey examines the theory the evidence Foust has assembled and what the honest answer to the question actually looks like. The theory is not that Kiriakou lied about going to prison. He went to prison. It is not that his opposition to CIA torture was fabricated. His opposition appears genuine and his prosecution appears to have been genuine. The theory is more specific and more structurally alarming than a simple controlled opposition argument — it is that the CIA's relationship with its most prominent public critics is more complicated than the whistleblower-versus-institution binary that the public narrative presents, that specific elements of Kiriakou's post-prison public positioning serve institutional interests in ways that are worth examining, and that the history of CIA management of its own critics through mechanisms more subtle than prosecution is documented and relevant to how we evaluate public figures who claim to be former intelligence officers speaking truth to power. The evidence Foust presents is specific behavioral and institutional rather than documentary — there is no classified file confirming or denying the theory. What he has assembled is a pattern of specific statements specific omissions specific choices about what to confirm and what to deny and specific moments in Kiriakou's public career where his behavior is more consistent with someone managing a narrative than with someone who has genuinely broken from the institution that imprisoned him. Julian Dorey examines each element of that pattern honestly — acknowledging what it establishes what it does not establish and why the theory deserves serious analytical attention even for people who find it uncomfortable. The Kiriakou-Bustamante conflict adds the most recently relevant context. Kiriakou has taken direct public swipes at Andrew Bustamante's CIA career claims. Julian Dorey examines what that conflict reveals about how intelligence community figures manage public narratives about CIA credentialing — and whether the conflict itself fits the pattern Foust has identified. **Inside This Clip:** - Zach Foust's full theory that John Kiriakou is still CIA — what the theory actually claims - Why the theory is more nuanced and more structurally alarming than simple controlled opposition - The specific behavioral and institutional evidence Foust has assembled for the theory - Why Kiriakou's post-prison public positioning is more consistent with narrative management than genuine rupture - The documented history of CIA managing its own critics through mechanisms more subtle than prosecution - The Kiriakou-Bustamante conflict and what it reveals about how CIA credentialing is managed publicly - Julian Dorey's honest assessment of what the evidence supports and what it does not - Why the theory deserves serious analytical attention even for people who find it uncomfortable - What the honest answer to the Kiriakou still CIA question actually looks like - Why Zach Foust's investigative approach to intelligence community figures matters for how we evaluate public CIA critics This is the theory about John Kiriakou that the intelligence accountability community has been uncomfortable examining — presented by the rogue investigator who pulled the thread and by the host who takes it seriously enough to examine it honestly. --- ***TIMESTAMPS*** 0:00 - Joe Kent, Kiriakou, Zach's Army & Afghanistan Days 10:00 - Prison Kingpins, Afghan Ping Pong, Bin Laden 20:18 - Bin Laden Doubts, Tribalism & the Debt Society 29:46 - Inflation NEVER Stops, 2008, & Federal Reserve 39:52 - Reserve Requirements Hit 0%, Rothschilds, Friedman & Bernanke 57:20 - Telecom Bill 1995, Lutnick & JP Morgan's Bailout @JulianDoreyDaily