John discusses being called "Mr Nothing", organic farmer and his discomfort with the title "mystic," although he acknowledges its embrace of the unknowable. Producer: Phil Shankland, InSight New Media Productions Ltd https://insightnewmedia.co.uk Date: 23 January 2025 Video Copyright: Spiritual Unfoldment Trust 2025 Title design: Wendy Mayes Design https://www.wendymayes.co.uk You can watch all 7 new conversations with John and Phil in church in the 'To Make Whole Be Whole' section here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=UUMOi0TFuqj6eND-mJRf8i2Tnw 1. Non-duality (22:33) 2. All seeing eye (42:16) 3. In the world but not of it (33:03) 4. Beyond belief? (40:15) 5. The great calling (38:33) 6. Lighten our darkness (36:22) 7. Lost in thought (35:09) John's Butler's first audiobook 'Mystic Approaches' is now available on Audible - https://www.audible.co.uk/pd/Mystic-Approaches-Audiobook/B0DQ64PF5P John's latest book 'Mystic Love' is now available here - https://spiritualunfoldment.co.uk/store/Mystic-Love-%E2%80%93-letters-to-Christine-p674982505 You can watch 80+ ad-free videos with John in the "Feet on the Ground' supporters section. Join here - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCi0TFuqj6eND-mJRf8i2Tnw/join. Those wanting more detailed accounts of John's life experience - the formative influences, which have taught and made him what he is, will find it in his 9 published books, available through the website: https://spiritualunfoldment.co.uk/store/. Did you know you can now listen to John on Spotify and other audio platforms? Here is his most popular recording 'Common sense guide to meditation' (1m views) - https://ffm.to/commonsenseguidetomeditation. FREE 86pp PDF 'Introducing Spiritual Unfoldment' With tempting extracts describing his life-long spiritual journey - in the hope they will encourage readers to go further, buy his books and read the whole story for themselves, we invite you to join John Butler's email community and receive a free 86-page PDF 'Introducing Spiritual Unfoldment'. Go to http://spiritualunfoldment.co.uk and scroll to the bottom of any page. Those who wish to support the Work of the Spiritual Unfoldment Trust can donate here - https://www.paypal.com/donate/?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=BBAWMHB4JQMKY Find out more about the the Spiritual Unfoldment Trust: https://spiritualunfoldment.co.uk/charitable-trust/ Disclaimer: https://spiritualunfoldment.co.uk/disclaimer Topics Mysticism and the ‘Don’t-Know’ Mind John discusses his affinity for the term "mystic" as representing the unknown, unknowable, and beyond-definition—a realm he feels at home in, contrasted with the world’s need for labels and certainty. Non-Duality and Pure Perception The heart of the conversation explores Meister Eckhart’s notion that the eye through which we see God is the same eye through which God sees us—one seeing, one knowing, one love. John and Phil explore the implications for consciousness, observation, and the illusion of separateness. The Watcher and the Practice of Observation John describes meditative practices that encourage observing the body, speech, and mind—leading to the discovery of the "watchman" or pure observer beyond ego and identity. Religious Symbolism: Icons and the All-Seeing Eye They explore spiritual symbols such as St George, the eye in the triangle, the dome in Russian churches, and the Eye of Providence, drawing connections between religious art, perception, and awareness. Transcendence, Mortality, and the Mystery of God The conversation concludes with reflections on the end of life, the unknowability of God, and the paradox of infinite mercy coexisting with human foolishness. John emphasizes the importance of humility and the sacred mystery of “not knowing.” Keywords: Mysticism Consciousness Observation Non-duality Providence Chapters: (00:00) What Is a Mystic? John Butler on Labels and the Unknown John discusses being called "Mr Nothing" and his comfort with the title "mystic," which he prefers for its embrace of the unknowable. (08:25) Presence, Icons, and the Path to Inner Peace Through the symbolism of St George and Russian Orthodox icons, John explains how spiritual imagery points to serenity, presence, and divine observation. (11:38) Meister Eckhart’s Eye: One Seeing, One Knowing, One Love Phil introduces Meister Eckhart’s mystical insight that God’s seeing and our seeing are one, sparking a discussion on perception and unity. (17:30) From Separation to Pure Consciousness: The Observer's Journey John explains how meditation reveals the illusory nature of ego and duality, replacing it with unified perception and inner peace. (29:22) The All-Seeing Eye and the Infinite Mystery of God Exploring symbols like the Eye of Providence, John and Phil reflect on divine knowing, death, and the endless depth of the mystic path.