Matt Mullenweg is the co-founder of WordPress, the open source platform powering a staggering 43% of the internet. He also serves as CEO of Automattic—the parent company of brands like WordPress.com, WooCommerce, and Tumblr—which is worth over $7 billion, with over 1,700 employees across 90 countries. In this episode, he discusses some of the most controversial topics surrounding WordPress, Automattic, and the broader open source community. What you’ll learn: • Matt’s response to public criticism • Why products like Meta’s Llama are “fake open source” • How his team is turning around Tumblr after acquiring it for just $3 million (after Yahoo bought it for $1.1 billion) • Why he mortgaged his home to fund San Francisco’s iconic Bay Lights project • Matt’s philosophy: “Don’t just build a product; build a movement” • Why open source matters: “If the Founding Fathers were around today, they’d be open source advocates” — Brought to you by: • WorkOS—Modern identity platform for B2B SaaS, free up to 1 million MAUs: https://workos.com/lenny • Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security: https://vanta.com/lenny • Loom—The easiest screen recorder you’ll ever use: http://loom.com/lenny Find the transcript at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-creator-of-wordpress-opens-up-matt-mullenweg Where to find Matt Mullenweg: • X: https://x.com/photomatt • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mattm/ • Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/photomatt/ • Website: https://ma.tt/ Where to find Lenny: • Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com • X: https://twitter.com/lennysan • LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/ In this episode, we cover: (00:00) Introduction to Matt Mullenweg (05:10) Matt’s career journey (11:15) Bay Lights project and philanthropy (17:28) How Matt got involved with open source (23:25) Why products like Meta’s Llama are “fake open source” (27:14) The future of open source and how to get involved (35:25) Building a successful online community (39:12) The WP Engine controversy (50:24) Facing criticism and controversy (55:29) Addressing community concerns (01:08:29) Forking Advanced Custom Fields (01:11:15) The role of social media and public perception (01:16:43) Acquiring and reviving Tumblr (01:24:25) Automattic’s acquisition strategy (01:28:51) Final thoughts and future plans Referenced: • WordPress: https://wordpress.com/ • Automattic: https://automattic.com/ • CNET: https://www.cnet.com/ • Akismet: https://akismet.com/wordpress/ • Jetpack: https://jetpack.com/ • Toni Schneider on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tonischneider/ • WooCommerce: https://woocommerce.com/ • Beeper: https://www.beeper.com/ • Day One: https://dayoneapp.com/ • Simplenote: https://simplenote.com/ • Pocket Casts: https://pocketcasts.com/ • Creative Commons: https://creativecommons.org/ • Audrey Capital: https://audrey.co/ • Stripe: https://stripe.com/ • SpaceX: https://www.spacex.com/ • Calm: https://www.calm.com/ • August: https://august.com/ • Daylight Computer: https://daylightcomputer.com/ • Keys Jazz Bistro: https://keysjazzbistro.com/ • Joomla: https://www.joomla.org/ • Drupal: https://new.drupal.org/ • Shopify: https://www.shopify.com/ • Wix: https://www.wix.com/ • Squarespace: https://www.squarespace.com/ • Tumblr: https://www.tumblr.com/ • Gravatar: https://gravatar.com/ • The Bay Lights: https://illuminate.org/projects/thebaylights/ • The Bay Lights 360: https://illuminate.org/the-bay-lights-360/ • Ben Davis on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ben-davis-sf/ • Kinder High School for the Performing and Visual Arts: https://www.houstonisd.org/hspva • Jack Dorsey: We’re Losing our Free Will to Algorithms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_8NganZSFI • Marc Andreessen: https://a16z.com/author/marc-andreessen/ • Bill Gurley on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/billgurley/ • An inside look at X’s Community Notes | Keith Coleman (VP of Product) and Jay Baxter (ML Lead): https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/how-x-built-the-best-fact-checking-system-on-the-internet • Llama: https://www.llama.com/ • WordCamp US & Ecosystem Thinking: https://ma.tt/2024/09/ecosystem-thinking/ • As Wall Street Chases Profits, Fire Departments Have Paid the Price: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/17/us/fire-engines-shortage-private-equity.html • WordCamp Asia: https://asia.wordcamp.org/2025/ ...References continued at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-creator-of-wordpress-opens-up-matt-mullenweg Recommended book: • Maintenance: Of Everything (in progress): https://books.worksinprogress.co/book/maintenance-of-everything/addenda/page/introduction Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com. Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.